Chris Pitzer

Chris Pitzer, Lisa Pitzer and Josh Cotter. Photo by Kevin Church.

Chris Pitzer's AdHouse Books debuted in 2002, when it published Joel Priddy's Pulpatoon Pilgrimage. Since then, AdHouse has released a steady slate of books, including the popular Project anthologies, Hope Larson's Salamander Dream, and Josh Cotter's Skyscrapers of the Midwest. This Fall, AdHouse is set to publish Paul Pope's Pulphope, as well as the third and final Project anthology, Project: Romantic.

So, this year's MoCCA Art Festival has come and gone. How did the show go for you this year?

I thought the show was great as usual. As I think I might have mentioned at the show, we ran out of a few books (Salamander Dream) and comics (Superior Showcase 1) a bit earlier than I had hoped, but that's still a good thing. In addition, Skyscrapers of the Midwest sold the best it has sold at any show we've attended. MoCCA rocks!

The show does rock. I feel like I missed out on something by working through most of it—it hadn't really occurred to me that working the show was actually, you know, working. What goes into that side of it, from your end? I mean, aside from selling books, do you look at submissions, or seek out new artists, or anything like that?

Yeah. I even made the comment to Josh Cotter that I'm going to go to MoCCA next year and just walk around! Because, as you know, when you're behind the table, you kind of miss what's going on at the other 98 percent of tables.

Doing the shows can be a whole lot of work, or just a little. You kind of decide how far you want to take it. For instance, with this show, AdHouse had to register, figure out what artists might be attending/sitting with AdHouse, submit an advertisement, ship our books, receive those nice new serigraphs from Paul Pope, do our sales and marketing (preview books!), have some quick meetings with artists, and receive submissions.

To go into a few details: I took the cover proofs of Debbie Huey's new Bumperboy book for her to review. I also had a quick conversation with Farel Dalrymple about his interest in doing Superior Showcase 2. Then, as you might have noticed, Mike Dawson had a preview copy of his Freddie & Me book sitting on the AdHouse table, so we kind of finalized our intentions of publishing it while at MoCCA.

I try not to look at submissions at the show, as that usually takes more brainpower than I can pull together. If people want to leave me things, I'll usually take them to hopefully review later. And by "seeking out new artists" I usually try and walk the floor a few times to see what might be neat. It's tough, though, since the more I'm away from the table, the more gets placed on either the helpers or artists that are there instead.

Now, you’ve also set up at other (and there really isn’t a good way to put this) more mainstream shows. I know the vibe is somewhat different, but how does the experience change for you, as a publisher, from something like an SPX or a MoCCA to something like Heroes Convention?

Well, I don't know if Heroes is a fair example of a mainstream show. They (Dustin and Shelton, as well as all their help) have really gotten behind the Indie Island push. As you can kind of tell by the amount of professionals going into their show, they really know how to treat people right. But I understand where you're coming from; it is a different environment. I guess I'd have to say that I spend more time trying to educate the consumer base to what AdHouse is about at the more mainstream shows. For instance, I recall James Jean signing at Heroes last year, and the line formed down the side of our booth, the side which had all the AdHouse stock displayed. While there might have been a few people who picked up a book and took a look, I don't think anyone made any purchases (I can't blame them since I’ve done the same thing). I'm just saying that I guess I have more of a "brand" at the alternative shows, and people will take more of a chance at those types of shows.

And then you have a place like San Diego, and it's like four or five different types of shows going on at once!

A while back, I was talking to Danielle Corsetto at the Pittsburgh show, and she mentioned something about how at a more superhero-oriented show, small press people can do pretty well, as there's less competition in terms of getting that "independent reader" market share. I'd imagine, though, that something like Project: Telstar or project: Superior would do pretty well at that kind of show. What made you want to publish those anthologies (as well as the upcoming Project: Romantic)? I mean, what is it about those themes in particular?

Yeah, I have to agree with Danielle. There is something to being the different fish in the big pond of the mainstream.

The themes of Telstar (robots and space), Superior (superheroes) and Romantic (love) follow my ego-centric take on life. Basically, my growing up watching Ultraman and Johnny Socko on channel 20 out of Washington, D.C., my finding comics during my middle school years and really collecting them, and then having the ol' hormones kick in around those high school years.

Other themes like "big monsters" or "the wild west" have been floated around or suggested, but I guess those were never really part of me growing up, so I kind of decided against them.

Granted, graphic design has been a pretty big part of my life, and something I still find fascinating. So, for a while there, Romantic was going to have a design theme, but I felt that was kind of too narrow.

Maybe narratively narrow, but I can see where that might get a little strange. At the same time, that might have turned out neat, like your own version of 99 Ways To Tell a Story, or something like that.

I had something else to ask, but since you've brought the design thing up, that's how you got started working in comics, right?

Yep. Back in 1990 I got hired at Eclipse Comics as their production/designer guy. I lasted around a year before I had to get out of there. However, I made some good friends out of my stint, and some great contacts. After I left, I did some comic freelance here and there and eventually helped Jeff Mason with putting together the 9-11: Emergency Relief book that Alternative published. The next year I started AdHouse with Joel Priddy’s Pulpatoon Pilgrimage.

That book put AdHouse on the map in a big way—it was nominated for an Eisner, and won an Ignatz. That's actually one of the things that interested me most in AdHouse from a publishing standpoint—it seems that the trend in the last six years or so is for a new publisher to get a buzz going, and then they start to publish so many books that they end up going under. AdHouse, though—the expansion seems very deliberately measured, which I think helps keep the quality of the line at a higher average. Is it a gut thing, this pacing, or was it more from studying the market?

Finances?

Seriously, the market kind of dictates what I can publish. I'll take a loan here and there for the big books, but I don't want to dig a deep whole that I'll never get out of, y'know? So, I try and balance the moneymakers with the not-so-moneymakers. But before all of that, I guess I have to love the book. I think Jeff Mason told me that once, and it's really true. Because even with some financial gains, each book is a lot of work.

There have been a few books that I've had to pass on at the time due to finances, but they've gone on to find good homes.

Outside of the things you solicit, like the anthologies, what makes you love something already completed? I mean, is there a certain type of work that you look at and say, "Hey, this looks like an AdHouse book!" I mean, I imagine there's a difference between loving something as a reader, and loving something as a publisher.

Well, I think I have to love something as a reader first. After that, yeah, I start to look at the publishing side of things. For instance, let's look at Salamander Dream. Things it had going for it in regards to the publishing side: it was finished, it was accomplished, it is unique in the whole graphic-iconic-narrative that only a few people seem to be doing, it was two color, it had an online fanbase, it has a young adult content, it was a "debut" work, and Hope is a female comic creator. All of those things are assets in my mind.

That said, I have been a publisher before a reader on a few projects, but those were books that were being created by a creator who had a proven track record.

And I don't know if I can define an "AdHouse" book or feel anymore. The output seems to be all over the place! Someone used "whimsical" once and I guess that might work.

Well, going back to something you said earlier, I'd say "designed," but that probably has less to do with the work itself, and more to do with you and your background. I mean, every AdHouse book turns out really well-designed; I think there are some publishers and self-publishers that treat design as almost an afterthought. What, in your opinion, makes for a well-designed book?

The design should compliment the work, and if possible take it to the next level. I favor certain formats a bit more than others. I tend to like the smaller books that seem a bit more intimate, as opposed to magazine size formats. A cover that makes someone pick a book/comic up is a must. Borders and gutters of pages have to be at least a quarter of an inch! I hate when I have to crack a book's spine to see what got swallowed by the gutter.

All of that said, I guess it comes down to knowing your market and your message. If you want to resemble a certain movement in comics or publishing, you should be able to emulate that. If you want to march to your own drum, you should be able to emulate that.

There's a vast history of book design out there, and I think only a few actually check that out and use that information. I feel like I'm kind of rambling.

Communication! That's the answer!

So, who do you like and look up to in terms of design? I'm going to guess that Chip Kidd is one…

Jeez. Is that a loaded question?

So, are we talking comics or total design? And you know that as soon as I finish this list I'll think of others!

Let's say total.

Chip Kidd is cool. Charles Anderson (CSA) is a huge favorite of mine. I tried to get both of them into Romantic, but they had other irons in other fires. Speaking of Romantic, Brian Flynn of Super7 fame has some big design chops. I did a mini-comic on Lester Beall, so he's one of my favorite old school guys.

Comical-wise, Jacob Covey of Fantagraphics is putting out some simply beautiful work. He needs to win some awards if he hasn't. Chris Ware, natch. Brian Wood does good stuff. Paul Hornschemeier has a good eye. J Chris Campbell knows his way around a t-square. Tom Gauld of Cabanon produces some consitently good work. Jordan Crane is out there. His Non 5 is one of the most interesting publications ever produced. And I'll end with Tom Devlin at Drawn & Quarterly. I guess they've set the standard for what comic publishing and design can and should be. And Tom always made beautiful objects in his Highwater days.

The list could go on and on....

Hell, maybe it should go on and on. It's one of those parts of the publishing side of the industry that I think most fans—including myself—never really give much thought to. But it's such an integral part to getting people to pick up a book. It's like a safety net for marketing, in a way, particularly in terms of cover design.

Does that kind of thing happen to you a lot? I mean, have you noticed if people have a lot of misconceptions about what goes on at the publisher end of things?

Sure. Heck, I had misconceptions to a degree. Until you get knee deep into it, you really won't know all the details. And even then, I'm sure it's not all the details. I think Larry Young did a great job in creating his True Facts book. Unfortunately, I still haven't read it, but I'm sure it's full of all types of information that is useful. Along the way, I've picked up knowledge from Larry, Jeff Mason, Ted Adams and a whole bunch of others that I'm sure I'm forgetting.

Essentially, there are two worlds for us sequential publishers: the direct market and the book market. They both play with different rules and expectations. It can boggle the mind sometimes.

Navigating those can be tough, I'm sure. Have you noticed any kinds of upswing in demand from the book market now that the (again, I'm not sure how to phrase this) the traditional book publishers have started graphic novel lines?

I don't think so. Or at least I'm not aware of it yet. I'm hoping a more direct connection might make a few of our titles make a bounce. For instance, Joel Priddy has the first story in Houghton Mifflin's new Best American Comics anthology. And then Hope Larson has that two-book deal with the Simon & Schuster imprint. So, here's hoping people might make the connection back to some of their earlier work with AdHouse.

But in regards to the book market, I think it currently comes down to the book and its availability. For instance, James Jean’s Process Recess has sold gangbusters through the book market. I have to believe those are Amazon or other online orders. Then again, that book just sells wherever it is.

I wonder if the people buying something like that are buying it as a comics-related thing, or as an art book. I kind of have the same curiosity regarding Pulphope, the upcoming Paul Pope book. (I’m sure you're thinking, "Hey, when's he going to get to our books?" at this point!)

Thanks for having the preview copy on hand for that at MoCCA, by the way--it looks like it's going to be absolutely stunning. How did you go about acquiring that book--was it something Pope had already been working on, or was it something you suggested?

Oh, I have to agree. When I was talking to one retailer at MoCCA about the Recess, he mentioned how a couple will come into his store and the man will go and buy his latest new comics off the rack, and the girl will look around, eventually pick up Recess, and end up purchasing it. So, many purchases of Recess are made by people who don't even know James Jean as a comic cover artist.

In regards to Pope, as you might recall, he did the introduction for Recess, and he was in Superior. What you might not know is that I've been writing Paul for around 15 years or so. Picking up his weird comics and stuff. Well, I guess he liked what AdHouse did with Recess and James, so he threw out the idea of doing his "monograph." So, my impression is that he had been thinking about doing it for a while, and some recent non-comic related projects really got the juices flowing to pull this book together.

With the changing political landscape, and the reaction to the Gordon Lee case and Alan Moore and Melinda Gebbie's Lost Girls, are you worried at all about the reaction to the erotica content in the book, or do you think the "monograph" nature of the book might limit that kind of reaction?

Well, the book is labeled mature readers, and as you mentioned, it should be consider more of a monograph, and thus only for adults. That said, sure, you have to worry about stuff like that, since every locale will dictate what they find to be pornography. Paul, my wife and I had a rather lengthy discussion on the matter on Monday afternoon in New York City. We weren't really talking about his book, but more about Lost Girls. Anyway, Paul brought up his belief that drawings cannot be considered pornographic. But, I don't want to put words in his mouth or anything, so I'll just leave it at that. My understanding of why he created the erotic section of the book was his trying to decipher what is erotic versus pornographic.

That'll be an interesting thing to read. People debate that kind of thing quite often, and I'd like to see Paul's take on it. You said there will be essays on all sorts of comics-related things. How much of the book is text, would you say?

Maybe a sixth to an eighth? I'm just guessing here, since we're just starting to lay the book out. I just received the discs in the mail, and Paul told me that there were at least five essays on the disc. I seem to recall the subject matter of the essays might be manga, sci-fi, comics, erotica and rock? I've read the manga essay, and I found it very entertaining.

Let's move on to your other big project for the fall, Project: Romantic. What can readers expect from the new anthology?

All types of love wrapped in 4-color goodness. New voices jumping in and showing what they can do. Some familiar faces coming back to finish up their run on the "projects." I'm still juggling the roster of talent for the book, so there will even be some last minute surprises. But all in all, it's a very colorful and exciting book. We have traditional stories, some adventure pages (those type of stories that give you different endings depending on what page you turn to), some top-notch illustrations, and even some of my comical-crap. People seem to dig the Project anthologies, and that makes me happy.

I think part of that may be because in the average consumer's mind, there's more of a reason to buy themed anthologies than non-themed ones. I know that my wife would be more likely to buy a horror anthology than I would because she gravitates towards that type of material, whereas something like Project: Romantic hits a very specific chord with me.

When you put something like Project: Romantic together, what's the editing process like? Are you more critical and hands-on when you're soliciting work to meet a specific theme than when you're buying an independent, finished book, or do you let the artists do their own thing?

I'm pretty open in regards to the restrictions of the theme. Some creators take a very literal view of what romance means to them, and then others use it as an ingredient in creating the comics they want to create. Also, I'm pretty loose with the editing, too. I kind of edit in regards to who I invite to participate in the book. And then along the way, I ask for their story ideas, so I'm not getting something completely out in left field—although that might be a good thing! Then, as the stories come in, I'll read them over and get back to the artists if I think there are some glaring errors or confusion.

Case in point, originally Scott Morse had 28 pages. Granted, that may seem like a lot, but he's doing the one illustration per page type of story (and it is quite beautiful). But, as he got closer to finishing it, he realized that there was a two-page sequence that wasn't really working. After I received the art from him, I went to lay the story out, and since I had already started the book, I was going to put the original 28 pages in there. But after reading the story, and looking at those two pages, I really had to agree with him, those two pages didn't work, so they got axed. So now I either rearrange for a two-page drop-in, or move everything after Scott's story ahead two pages.

Fascinating stuff, no?

Actually, yeah, in a way, it is. The business side of things gets talked about so rarely that even the most dry stuff seems fresh, new and exciting. At least it does to me; we may be boring the snot out of anyone who reads it.

Kind of in the same general territory, how do you decide to group stories? Is there a specific rhythm to story placement?

Oh yeah, there's a method to the madness. I look for a rhythm in tone, page count, style, all those types of things. It gets tricky at times, given things like the adventure strip, or someone sending in an odd-page count, instead of even, but it all seems to be working out. Also, those artists who get me their stories earlier, tend to get placed towards the front of the book.

Too bad you're sharing that now. Didn't you say that this would be the last of the Project series? Why did you decide to end it here?

Three is the magic number. I feel a bit burnt out on the ol' antho-workings (this will be my seventh anthology in the last five years). And, wow, the market seems to be very full of anthologies of late. Today, I just saw a new one that I've never heard of before. I still might do our floppy-antho, called Superior Showcase, when we can fill an issue. At only 32 black-and-white pages, the cost is lower, and easier to manage.

That's not your only superhero-related comic, though. You're also publishing Zack Soto's The Secret Voice. I like the way that while you publish some superhero comics, they don't feel like "hey, we're trying to be Marvel or DC," like other superhero-centered comics in the back half of the Previews catalogue. What do you think AdHouse brings to the superhero table, so to speak, even if you can't actually print those words in the comic?

I don't know if Zack really thinks of The Secret Voice as a superhero comic, though. Or maybe he does. I don't know. I always felt it was more adventure than superhero. Anyway, what AdHouse brings to the superhero niche is allowing these creators to pursue their own voice within the genre. The way I look at it, most of us have either been through the ol' superhero machine at some point of our lives, or not at all. I like mixing those types of creators up. That's why I got Hope Larson to do the cover of Superior Showcase 1. I kind of figured she had never drawn a superhero, and I wanted to see her take on it. It was fantastic!

Speaking of Soto, you've found a few artists through minicomics; Josh Cotter comes to mind, too. At MoCCA, I was amazed by how tight the originals of his skyscrapers of the Midwest pages were. I don't think I've ever seen comics drawn to scale before. What was it about Skyscrapers that made you want to translate it from minicomics to its current form?

Well, it's a damn good comic. He was an accomplished comic creator that, to my knowledge, came out of nowhere. His stuff was just that damn good. If he wanted to keep making the minis, I'd be happy as a clam, but I really wanted to help him spread the word, and get him into as many comic shops as possible. So, while there are a few comic shops that will carry the minis, I thought making a traditional formatted comic was the way to go. But we didn't even do that, since the comic is fifty-plus pages, and printed on tinted paper. But yeah, Josh's originals are crazy. I showed you how he does his cover paintings smaller than what they'll be printed at, right? Crazy…

At this point, though, is that traditional issue format itself still as immutable as it once was? Do you think that differing formats for periodical comics (like Fantagraphics' Ignatz line, the Or Else books) is something we'll see in the future?

I think formats are an interesting answer in part of the equation of creating a book or comic. That said, you really have to step back at times, and not get "format tunnel-vision," not letting the cart lead the horse, so to speak. Content should lead.

If a format is going to be very different or "weird," a publisher should try and convey as much information as possible to the public in the beginning so that they're not surprised. Having been a pre-ordering fanboy at one time, I've been upset at a few comics that have come out that might have been a bit less than what I thought they were going to be.

The future? Sure, I think publishers will still be experimenting with formats. However, you have to keep an eye to the retailer, too. If you make something that isn't retailer friendly, you might be cutting off sales.

How do you maintain "retailer friendliness"? I know you've said in previous interviews that AdHouse has a small penetration into the direct market—or, rather, a smaller percentage in terms of what Marvel and DC get—but the ones who do buy your product seem to like you guys a whole lot. I guess what I'm asking is, what are you doing right (which, I suppose, is nicer than asking "so what is Publisher X doing wrong," or something like that)?

Oh, yeah—the consumer! Sure, I think format is an issue with the consumer. I know it is with me. You always have to wonder where you're going to put that huge book that won't fit on the shelf, or that mini that is the size of a postage stamp. I tend to think the traditional 6x10 standard format is the one that people most relate to, but that shouldn't stop us from pushing the boundaries every now and again.

Retailer friendliness… I imagine it comes down to certain actions that they hold in high regard. Ship your items on time. Don't sell a book before they have a chance to sell it. Give them distribution options. Market a book to the best of your abilities. Offer the right percentage discounts. Create product that consumers will want to purchase. I know that last one is kind of a given, but I have to believe it's an issue, to some degree.

Well, I think that's a good, bare-bones strategy.

So, is there anything else you want to draw attention to before we close this?

Skyscrapers of the Midwest 3 just came out a few weeks ago. If you haven't given Skyscrapers a chance, you can get a taste over at Josh Cotter's site. Also, Debbie Huey's Bumperboy and the Loud, Loud Mountain comes out next month, and you can find Debbie attending the San Diego Comicon, so please stop by and tell her "howdy."

And speaking of shows, AdHouse plans to have a presence at the following shows for the rest of the year: Heroescon, Baltimore Comicon, SPX and the Stumptown Comic Fest. These are some of the best shows run by the best people. If you have the time and money, you should really come out to check out what these shows are doing, and what AdHouse is doing. Otherwise, I guess that's it. That's all I can think of, anyways.

This interview was conducted by Ed Cunard.